Macintosh conversion/editing

[Norbert]

Why Mac graphics of the original game can't be imported for PC? Technical reasons, or copyright?

As you probably know, the Macintosh graphics are double the DOS dimensions. (See, for example, the title screen for DOS and Macintosh.) So, technical reasons. Although both SDLPoP (related GitHub) and MININIM (related video) have on-going efforts to add support for Macintosh and other size graphics.

[...], because in this program i see several rooms.

The apoplexy editor (version 3.1 and newer) can kind of show the level if you press "m" on the main screen.
Then, on that new Map window, you can click rooms to edit them via the main window.
This workflow should work particularly well on larger screens.

[Coco]

Macintosh graphics are double the DOS dimensions

Soooo, I'm gonna guess that scaling down Mac images (even if they lose a little quality) is out of the picture (if such images exist in some regular format).
Man, how much programming experience does it take to port the whole damn game, or make an editor for it...

[Norbert]

Man, how much programming experience does it take to port the whole damn game, or make an editor for it...

Recreating a game from a disassembly or from scratch is a lot of work, and doing it well requires extensive programming experience.

As for an editor. Assuming the game disk does not contain an image for each room (as PoP2 for SNES) but separate tiles, it should be relatively easy to create a basic editor. In particular if the level format is easy to figure out. I should be able to create one, especially if David would give me some pointers. But if someone else feels up to it, maybe I should deliberately stay away from it, to give someone else the chance to contribute an editor. I think I've not given the Macintosh version much thought because, with the exception of its graphics, it's so similar to other versions. When it's possible to use Macintosh graphics with SDLPoP and MININIM, a Macintosh level editor may quickly become an unused relic. Of course, things become gradually more difficult when going beyond just a basic editor, for example when making it cross-platform, when allowing the user to drag-and-drop rooms, etc. Something else that should be possible is to create a program that converts DOS levels to Macintosh levels, either straight from DAT to the game image, or from (e.g. apoplexy) XML exports.

[David]

As for an editor. Assuming the game disk does not contain an image for each room (as PoP2 for SNES) but separate tiles, it should be relatively easy to create a basic editor. In particular if the level format is easy to figure out. I should be able to create one, especially if David would give me some pointers. But if someone else feels up to it, maybe I should deliberately stay away from it, to give someone else the chance to contribute an editor.

There already is an editor for PoP1 Mac: https://www.popot.org/level_editors.php?editor=PoPMap
It runs only on MacOS, though.

The format of the level is specified in this document: https://www.popot.org/documentation.php ... ifications (section 3.9)
This part is not true, though: "DAT 1.0 for Mac does not have any index and checksums."
Instead, levels are stored as LEVL resources in the main executable, using the standard resource fork format of MacOS. (See here.)

Something else that should be possible is to create a program that converts DOS levels to Macintosh levels, either straight from DAT to the game image, or from (e.g. apoplexy) XML exports.

There indeed was such a converter, called PoP Macintosh Total Pack: http://popuw.com/mac.html

[David]

Moved posts to a new topic.

[Norbert]

The format of the level is specified in this document: https://www.popot.org/documentation.php ... ifications (section 3.9)

Ah. Well, then someone could create an editor using that document.
Or use one of the existing programs you mentioned.

[Norbert]

Ah. Well, then someone could create an editor using that document.

I'm thinking about maybe doing this, while also somewhat dreading the idea, given the required effort. I don't see anyone else doing it, and some players appear to want a (modern) Mac editor. Apparently the level format is mostly already documented.

However, which game file or disk image should I use? Maybe a .sit file, but this requires StuffIt Expander. Maybe a .hqx file, but this requires BinHex 4. Maybe something unpacked, like the .hfs files at popot.org, but while I can mount those on GNU/Linux, I'd probably have difficulty accessing its files under Windows, and even when mounting the files they appear to lose at least some of their data/properties.

Also, which emulator? I can't pick just any game file or disk image I can easily edit; the game also needs to run. I preferably want the same emulator for Linux and Windows - and for this port probably also macOS - users. Even if it means some users have to use an emulator to run the emulator. (For leapop, GNU/Linux users use Wine to run PoP for Apple II in AppleWin.) Regardless, because of copyrights, I probably should not ship with PERFORMA.ROM or System70_boot.dsk, but if necessary users could still be told these files are required.

Thoughts?

[realXCV]

You could use MacBinary files.

[Norbert]

You could use MacBinary files.

Thanks for the input.
Can you elaborate.
Where can I download this PoP MacBinary, and how to run it with which emulator?

[realXCV]

MacBinary files don’t have any special encoding in them unlike .sit or .hqx files and have all their content in the data fork. That means you can put them on a Windows or Linux machine without worrying about losing the resource fork. Also, since there’s no encoding, you can easily access and edit the LEVL resources in them.

Now, where to download them and which emulator to use: no ideas. But how to use it: you convert them back to the original files in the emulator. This can be done with apps like Stuffit Expander.

[DridiSara123]

Here you can download Macintosh Emulator: https://basilisk.cebix.net/

[Norbert]

To prevent misunderstandings: I'm not working on an editor right now, because I cannot.
Someone - David, maybe? - would have to help me to find a suitable disk image I could use.
I don't know how to get started.
The only working emulation I know of, to access the game, is to run an image inside an old Mac OS.
If I would create an modern editor, it cannot run this editor inside an old Mac OS.

[realXCV]

Start by choosing the features you want to include in your editor.

[Norbert]

Attached are all the different files/disk images that I know exist.

[realXCV]

One of your .hqx file is corrupted, the other includes .sit compression.

Here are two new zip of files/disk images you didn't know exist.