Researching the Repetition of Time
Re: Researching the Repetition of Time
Okay, 4,500 words later I'm back with another thing I can't quite work out! It's this guard on level 8 and his sudden disappearance.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7gg_DTLqlM&t=23m
By now I've got some idea of how this game fits together, so I can go part of the way The potion at the top right opens the exit door - it's a copy-protection potion that activates the tile at the top left of room 8, which in turn opens the exit door. The guard disappears about 12 seconds after the exit has opened, which matches up with the time in Norbert's document about level 8, so this is surely something to do with the mouse event - but what makes him disappear? Does the game attempt to create the mouse, therefore taking up the slot for the other character on screen and deleting the guard, then give up on displaying the mouse as well because it's immediately inside a wall?
And Norbert - for acknowledgement in the video, how do you pronounce your name? Is it NOR-bert, or nor-BERR, or something else entirely?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7gg_DTLqlM&t=23m
By now I've got some idea of how this game fits together, so I can go part of the way The potion at the top right opens the exit door - it's a copy-protection potion that activates the tile at the top left of room 8, which in turn opens the exit door. The guard disappears about 12 seconds after the exit has opened, which matches up with the time in Norbert's document about level 8, so this is surely something to do with the mouse event - but what makes him disappear? Does the game attempt to create the mouse, therefore taking up the slot for the other character on screen and deleting the guard, then give up on displaying the mouse as well because it's immediately inside a wall?
And Norbert - for acknowledgement in the video, how do you pronounce your name? Is it NOR-bert, or nor-BERR, or something else entirely?
Re: Researching the Repetition of Time
Yes, except most likely it does display the mouse, but the author modified the x (and maybe y) starting coordinate of the mouse, to make its path end inside a wall somewhere. I'm currently too busy to check.
Thanks, but acknowledgement is unnecessary.
If you feel it's a must, you can stick to just my first name (pronunciation).
A lot of what I know I've learned from David; I'm guessing you already have him on your list.
Good luck wrapping up your RoT project.
Not on sale?
It's the "Lunar New Year Sale 2020"...
Re: Researching the Repetition of Time
When you wrote "same name", did you mean only your first name?
Now I wonder where does he put them instead.
You're right, the mouse and the guard use the same "slot".
(And the shadow uses the same slot as well.)
According to diffpop, the coordinates of the mouse were not changed.
If you remove the wall from the top left corner of room 16 (change it into a floor), the mouse will appear as in the original game.
Re: Researching the Repetition of Time
The video is out now! Thank you so much for your assistance in working these tricks out - the mechanics behind some of them are just amazing, and it was a great opportunity to look closer at the inner workings of one of my favourite games. Hope you enjoy the result
Re: Researching the Repetition of Time
Very informative and comprehensive!
Congratulations on successfully finishing the video.
I never knew why the player dies near the spilled big potion.
Thanks to your video, now I do.
"...the player then has a route to the exit... as well as a headache."
Hah.
Re: Researching the Repetition of Time
Thanks! And yes, I was very proud of that
Re: Researching the Repetition of Time
Re: Researching the Repetition of Time
Since version 3.10, this randomization now requires (asks for) confirmation.Norbert wrote: ↑January 14th, 2020, 11:40 amThis randomization is the intended behavior. Keys "\" and "|" also do this (see docs/keys.txt). The idea behind this is that it can be used by modders to find unexpected layouts/tricks/etc., that they might not have thought of themselves, through playtesting.
Re: Researching the Repetition of Time
Back to the original topic, there is a reason why that "underwhelming" trick with a loose tile was implemented on level 12B. The way falling tiles in the first 2 rooms are implemented stops regular loose tiles from shaking when the kid jumps which made the trick much less obvious. The same behavior applies to the brittle tiles that can only get loose by a falling tile.
In my mod I separated those behaviors and made loose tiles always shake while brittle tiles never shake. It allowed a couple of interesting twists in the game and made level 12B behave like the rest of them.
Also, on level 5 the video does not make it clear that you need to drink the blue potion when going to the left tower. Otherwise, you will be stuck with the shadow when you return.
In my mod I separated those behaviors and made loose tiles always shake while brittle tiles never shake. It allowed a couple of interesting twists in the game and made level 12B behave like the rest of them.
Also, on level 5 the video does not make it clear that you need to drink the blue potion when going to the left tower. Otherwise, you will be stuck with the shadow when you return.
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Re: Researching the Repetition of Time
Hmm, that's interesting!
No wonder KingOfPersia has seriously played very very very very great attention to these things.
And yes, you need to drink that blue potion otherwise shadow returns because that raise button which you keep help also opens the gate through which shadow enters.
No wonder KingOfPersia has seriously played very very very very great attention to these things.
And yes, you need to drink that blue potion otherwise shadow returns because that raise button which you keep help also opens the gate through which shadow enters.
Re: Researching the Repetition of Time
Absolutely. Creating those special effects with the mouse and the huge spilled potion without reading the source code probably required a lot of experimentation and attention to details. The same is true about level 12B considering it does not have any regular loose tiles.atrueprincefanfrom18 wrote: ↑October 17th, 2020, 3:58 am No wonder KingOfPersia has seriously played very very very very great attention to these things.
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Re: Researching the Repetition of Time
I just noticed a funny bug in SDLPoP. If the Jaffar music is playing AND Jaffar dies AND we shift the room, the game assumes he is alive (or maybe only if there are more than one Jaffar type guards in the level). I have attached a replay. (v1.2.1)
Re: Researching the Repetition of Time
The "meet Jaffar" music plays if the level door opened flag has not been set. That flag is set when a guard dies on level 12B, which takes longer if Jaffar falls down. Once the flag is set the level door gets opened when you exit the room to the left.atrueprincefanfrom18 wrote: ↑October 17th, 2020, 8:35 am I just noticed a funny bug in SDLPoP. If the Jaffar music is playing AND Jaffar dies AND we shift the room, the game assumes he is alive (or maybe only if there are more than one Jaffar type guards in the level). I have attached a replay. (v1.2.1)
rot_sdlpop_bug.p1r
You probably would not be able to exit the level door.
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Re: Researching the Repetition of Time
Right, main question is how can it be fixed? It's a rare case, but technically should be fixed.